Using the popular words of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin ( some say it was G. I. Gurdjieff who said this): "We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience." One might also consider it this way: "We are not human beings on a spiritual journey, we are spiritual beings on a human journey."
I think the Buddha would approve of the above words. On the other hand, the belief that somehow the human body gives rise to spirit which then makes spirit dependent upon the flesh, seems implausible. It is even more implausible to believe there is no spirit—this is hopeless nihilism and maybe one of the worst sides of the human predicament.
Our real condition is always one of spirit in bondage to appearance which is never other than dependently originated and conditioned.
From a Buddhist perspective our human experience, which always ends up in death followed by never ending rebirth into still other forms, is never other than suffering in the final analysis. Spirit is in bondage to form, feeling, perception, volitional formations and consciousness, namely, the five grasping aggregates (pañcupādānakkhandhā). It is also spirit, which in bondage to the five aggregates, acts contrary to itself. It is always betraying itself in other words.
"Because the Tathagata does not enter ultimate liberation until all beings have entered ultimate liberation"
The heresy of the demonic doctrine of Mahayanism.
Posted by: David Brainerd | January 31, 2020 at 02:45 AM
Denial of an I is demonic stupidity.
Posted by: David Brainerd | January 31, 2020 at 02:42 AM
We grow old, then we die. This is the human fate. There is no escape.
Posted by: The absurd | January 30, 2020 at 10:13 PM
Zennist, I think it is true that spirit if we wish to call it that is “generally” in bondage to phenomena, that is in other words what describes the default condition of the sentient born into the world and destined to experience death and suffering. But it is also true, I think, that such bondage is not absolute and is largely dependent upon perspective and the degree to which one has realized the progressive path of the Buddhadharma. In other words it is neither true nor is it not to say that spirit is bound to flesh.
Unfortunately, for many people, this notion of spirit being bound to flesh (and this appears to be more or less the gist of gnostic Christianity for example, and other mystic/gnostic cycles such as Sufism) leads to a false view of an “I” separate from the flesh which (as I have attempted to point out previously) is really a superstition. The higher liberation would not therefore be liberation from flesh per se, but liberation from perspective of the flesh as a self-identity, and beyond that even from the concept of there being liberation from the flesh as a starting principle! Why is this? Because the Tathagata does not enter ultimate liberation until all beings have entered ultimate liberation, and for this reason it is taught that even the gods should repudiate conceptual ideas about the nature of ultimate liberation. Logically, this must include the rubric of Christian Gnosticism, being that of spirit liberated from the flesh.
To support this understanding, in the Vimalakirti Sutra, we find this:
"'Enlightenment is perfectly realized neither by the body nor by the mind. Enlightenment is the eradication of all marks. Enlightenment is free of presumptions concerning all objects. Enlightenment is free of the functioning of all intentional thoughts. Enlightenment is the annihilation of all convictions. Enlightenment is free from all discriminative constructions. Enlightenment is free from all vacillation, mentation, and agitation. Enlightenment is not involved in any commitments. Enlightenment is the arrival at detachment, through freedom from all habitual attitudes. The ground of enlightenment is the ultimate realm. Enlightenment is realization of reality. Enlightenment abides at the limit of reality.
Enlightenment is without duality, since therein are no minds and no things. Enlightenment is equality, since it is equal to infinite space.
"'Enlightenment is unconstructed, because it is neither born nor destroyed, neither abides nor undergoes any transformation. Enlightenment is the complete knowledge of the thoughts, deeds, and inclinations of all living beings. Enlightenment is not a door for the six media of sense. Enlightenment is unadulterated, since it is free of the passions of the instinctually driven succession of lives. Enlightenment is neither somewhere nor nowhere, abiding in no location or dimension. Enlightenment, not being contained in anything, does not stand in reality. Enlightenment is merely a name and even that name is unmoving. Enlightenment, free of abstention and undertaking, is energyless. There is no agitation in enlightenment, as it is utterly pure by nature. Enlightenment is radiance, pure in essence. Enlightenment is without subjectivity and completely without object. Enlightenment, which penetrates the equality of all things, is undifferentiated. Enlightenment, which is not shown by any example, is incomparable. Enlightenment is subtle, since it is extremely difficult to realize. Enlightenment is all-pervasive, as it has the nature of infinite space. Enlightenment cannot be realized, either physically or mentally. Why? The body is like grass, trees, walls, paths, and hallucinations. And the mind is immaterial, invisible, baseless, and unconscious.'
(The sutra referenced above):
https://www2.kenyon.edu/Depts/Religion/Fac/Adler/Reln260/Vimalakirti.htm
Posted by: n. yeti | January 30, 2020 at 11:21 AM